Bill,
A couple things to consider here. Whenever you have something flimsy for the nosecone, you need a stout bulkhead behind it. Even a weak ejection charge can blow thru a paper cone. The Quest HL-20 (stock) has a thin, flimsy disk behind the NC, and it can't take any sort of ejection charge. Mine let go on its first flight. I retro-fitted a disk in it while I was reattaching the nosecone.

As for the elastic, I'm not sure whether you're referring to the 4mm wide elastic (ie, cloth and rubber) or the new all-rubber cord. But either way, I've gotten away from all elastic/rubber cords and begun using kevlar. Kevlar doesn't snap the nosecone back into the rocket like elastic does. Seems I've had too many fins broken by the nosecones. And foremost, the rubber/elastic seems to get brittle (weak) after a couple of ejections.

I feel your pain on the hot ejections. I've popped the motor tubes off my Edmonds Tinee and CiCi several times with them. But I've begun building around the hot charges. I've had several core samples because of weak charges, and I'd rather beef up the recovery harness for hot charges than risk core samples with weak ones.

Doug

The paper nose cone was filled with wood glue for added weight. It was into this plug that the Kevlar was sunk. It had been drying for several weeks, but it may not have dried enough. The elastic felt oddly brittle when I picked it up, so that's also a possibility.
None of this excuses the fact that Estes is now producing ejection charges that harm more than they help. A few weeks back I had a vintage Mini Bomarc that was blown apart by the ejection charge. What stops something like that other than changing motor companies? I'm going to place an order for a Quest bulk pack after the holidays and compare them side by side. If that doesn't work I might just give this hobby up. It's no fun building rockets that get damaged or destroyed after a successful flight.

__________________
Bill Eichelberger
NAR 79563

http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I miss being SAM 0058

Build floor: Centuri Mini Dactyl Estes - Low Boom SST Semroc - Marauder, Shrike, SST Shuttle

In paint: Canaroc Starfighter Scorpion Estes F-22 Air Superiority Fighter, Multi-Roc, Solar Sailer II Semroc Cyber III

Ready to fly: Estes - Solar Sailer II Semroc - Earmark, Groonie Der V 1/2

I see what you guys are talking about with these Estes ejection charges. I didn't notice it right away but on my first flight of my T222-24 the motor tubes are like the Semroc ST-10's and the three Estes D12's blistered the motor tubes and paint so bad on the outside from the ejection charges that I had to insert Semroc ST-9's inside of them and resand repaint the rocket. If I wouldn't have "sleeved" these tubes with ST-9's I think they would burn through on future flights. Unfortunately this was my first flight also so needless to say I was pretty bummed out after spending all that time finishing that rocket.

__________________
Steve Naquin
TRA# 677 L2
NAR# 85518 L2
SAM# 0052

🚀 In Construction: Der Blue Maxx/Minie-Magg 5.5” & Vander-Burn MDRM Clone w/Stickershock23 Custom Decals
🚀 In Paint & Detail: USR Banshee
🚀 In Build Queue: Estes Doorknob w/Vander-Burn Rocketry Upgrade Kit [Sport Decor], Semroc Centurion-F, Semroc Egg Crate
🚀 In Repair: SLS Lil’ Hustler, SLS Aero-Dart 1969 Trim
🚀 Stay Tuned For Fall 2021 Launch Dates

Next time try a little Epoxy. It only takes a few hours to cure instead of weeks.

__________________
Steve Carr
NAR 82506

Bill,
Sorry about your Bomarc. I should add that I do sort through my motor stash looking for old ones with ordinary ejection charges when I'm flying one of my older rockets (one with a typical, non-bullet-proof recovery harness). I couldn't tell an Estes date code from a baloney expiration date (but I can tell you how to read the trace code on an STMicroelectronics real-time clock IC :)

Anyway, I just look for motors with the older, mono-chromatic labels - either all green or all purple. These tend to not blow the rockets apart. I try to save them and not use them in my beefed up rockets.

That said, I don't see old motors on the shelves much anymore. Seems like most of the old stuff has flushed thru, that most of the stores I frequent all have recent vintage motors.

Doug

The Bomarc had a new recovery system in it, and that worked fine. The damage occurred at ejection when both ram tubes were blown off of the rocket. Both were recovered, but I don't see myself ever trying to fly it again. Why risk it? I never thought of using the older engines, but I'm pretty sure I've cleared any out locally over the past five years.

__________________
Bill Eichelberger
NAR 79563

http://wallyum.blogspot.com/

I miss being SAM 0058

Build floor: Centuri Mini Dactyl Estes - Low Boom SST Semroc - Marauder, Shrike, SST Shuttle

In paint: Canaroc Starfighter Scorpion Estes F-22 Air Superiority Fighter, Multi-Roc, Solar Sailer II Semroc Cyber III

Ready to fly: Estes - Solar Sailer II Semroc - Earmark, Groonie Der V 1/2

I'm baaack - kinda. School's been kicking my rear since Sep & my last big project was due today (stayed up 'till 0500 local finishing a chair, got up at 0740 local by young daughter Sam, brushed teeth, drove in lake-effect snow, defended project during class critique, drove home, went to bed for a couple of hours of zzsss).

Anywho - what? Don't you have nasty weather down there? I keep hearing all this noise and whining from people in our southern climates having record low temps & inclement weather caused by global warming. Cold, ice, snow, etc, etc are incompatible with rocketry (or at least my core body temp & reflective, depilated & glabrous cranial surface...)

BTW - I just read some postings on TRF in their motor forum. I didn't post, but I've pretty good luck with the Quest motors & their ejection charges. That, & the motors are slightly smaller diameter, which I like. I've had to peel & fit way too many Estes motors (I know, I know - don't futz around & modify an engine, blah, blah, blah (insert smily with wiggly fingers under chin here...). That, or mess up the motor mount/body tube yanking the jammed motor out with pliers.

My only complaint about the Quest motors is the rocket's body tubes are a bit crusty & sooty (kinda like me right now), requiring more cleaning. Also, they don't quite have that traditional Estes ejection charge smell.

Also just got around to updating my signature to Rule Two

__________________
Rule Two On Dating My Daughter:
You do not touch my daughter in front of me. You may glance at her, so long as you do not peer at anything below her neck. If you cannot keep your eyes or hands off of my daughter's body, I will remove them.

We were at -4 here this morning. Just another day in WI!


That's because they use more sulfur in their mixture, which is also why they have better tracking smoke.


I like it! Luckily my eldest daughter is only 12 so I have a couple years reprieve still.

__________________
Scott D. Hansen
Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe - Your One Stop BAR Shoppe!
Ye Olde Rocket Plans - OOP Rocket Plans From 38 Companies!
Ye Olde Rocket Forum
WOOSH NAR Section #558

Couple? I don't think so, try MAYBE "one". Unless she is >12.5 then you have even less

She ain't dating until she's at LEAST 15!

__________________
Scott D. Hansen
Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe - Your One Stop BAR Shoppe!
Ye Olde Rocket Plans - OOP Rocket Plans From 38 Companies!
Ye Olde Rocket Forum
WOOSH NAR Section #558