Ye Olde Rocket Forum - View Single Post - Saturn C-8 / Nova in 1/100 Scale for the Forum to help design

Saturn C-8 / Nova Direct Ascent to the Moon Rocket

I'm not the best design person that is for sure, thought this might be fun for everyone. Please feel free to download and adjust the rocsim file and reload it for us all. I haven't see this rocket modeled before unless I missed something, which is always possible.

Make no mistake about it, it would be a job, but I believe this rocket could be built from the New Saturn V Skylab kit.

You would need the following extras depending on if you are sticking with the design idea at hand. Extra BT101 and > CPL 101 – 6” BT101 tube couplers to stretch and fill the kits BT 101 for the 1st stage which is 4.8” x 18” diameter unless someone knows where we can get a 4.8” diameter tube that is light weight; BT 58 for command module; Estes LEM plastic Shroud; Estes extra set of F1 plastic Engines to make up the 8 F1 engines for display; BT80 for four 24mm motor clustering layout; BT 50 for motor mount tubes; 3 “E” Engine hooks; ¼” Foam board with cardboard board front and back for making light centering rings; Apollo capsule from vendor of choice or 3d print your own.

I have to say, there really doesn’t appear to be much info out there for the Nova or the Saturn C-8. Nova seems to be a name used for several different rocket ideas, one of which was some 50’ diameter as compared to the Saturn V at 33’. The Nova that looks more like the Saturn C-8 had only one main difference between the Engine choices. They were looking at cutting the Nova down to a more manageable 40’ Diameter monster that would use eight F1 engines in the first stage, two larger “M1” size engines in the 2nd Stage and one J2 engine in the 3rd stage. Here is what one reference had to say about the M1:> “Aerojet's M-1 was the largest and most powerful liquid-hydrogen-fueled liquid-fuel rocket engine to be designed and component-tested. The M-1 offered a baseline thrust of 6.67 MN (1.5 million lbf) and 8 MN (1.8 million lbf) as its immediate growth target. If built, the M-1 would be larger and more efficient than the famed F-1 that powered the first stage of the Saturn V rocket to the Moon.”
The Saturn C-8 was going to use eight J2 engines in the 2nd Stage as compared to the Nova’s two M1’s.

There are some drawings of the Saturn C-8 but they just don’t appear reasonable to me because the 1st Stage is just to short. There was some printed 1st, 2nd and 3rd stage sizes for either rocket that agreed with one another but not with the drawings, so I went with these size specs and I also looked at the Saturn V for what was finally but to put this model together. The Nova/Saturn C-8 First Stage was planed at 40’x 160’; Second Stage was planed at 33’ x 140’ and the 3rd Stage was planed at 21.68’ x 58.30’.

For the First Stage of this design, I used the 160’ total length which includes F1 engines but not the Inter-stage Coupler as was the case when looking at the Saturn V’s first stage size. I also have the rocket the same distance off the ground as the Saturn V. I used the same size Fairings for the bottom flare ring. Doesn’t seem reasonable to have 8 fairings, so this one has a N1 style design as do many modern pictures. Not sure if this rocket would have had 8 fins or not since the F1 engines would have gimbaled as was the case with the Saturn V? I used the Saturn V Air-Frame reinforcement rings and location in laying out this rocket design to. Some was guessing with no real plans to help.

For the Second Stage of this design, I used the 140’ total length which includes the Inter-Stage Ring as was the case with the Saturn V. I again tried to use the Saturn V’s reinforcement ring sizes and locations to help with their placement. Most modern pictures don’t show a middle reinforcement ring on the 2nd Stage airframe of the Saturn C-8 / Nova, but I feel it would have been required as was the case with the Saturn V 2nd Stage. I used the same size as was used on the Saturn V 1st stage at that point.

3rd Stage of the two rockets were almost identical, with the Saturn C-8 / Nova being just a hair shorter at 58.3 as compared to 59’ for the Saturn V, so I went with 59’ and kept the 3rd Stage, LEM and command module the same as what was included on the Saturn V since I haven’t ran across any reliable draws of this part of the rocket. I didn’t include the escape tower in the rocsim design but it will be part of the design at this point.

I will have to say, that I don’t agree with Rocksim weight estimates. Even on the heavy side it should be no more than 32oz, but if the Saturn V model true weight is around 16oz, then I’m thinking more like 24 or so?

I’ll have to weight the parts as I go, because the CG and CP don’t look good at this point either.

So friends, just wanted to share this project with you and looking for any good ideas and recommendations before this is built. So if anyone has some really good pictures or true plans that would help in changing the rocket’s design, then please feel free to join in, because this project is a plan in motion.