Ye Olde Rocket Forum - Estes Saturn V...coming soon!

dwmzmm

03-13-2009, 08:29 PM

There was no signer...just the stock Customer Service tag. The email addy was WEBCS@centurims.com.

Ok, I've seen the domain "centurims.com" before, from several of the Estes employees I've
met at the Maker's Faire in Austin in October 2007......

If true (the release of the 1/100 scale Saturn - V), I wonder what that's going to do to SEMROC's planned release? I would guess nothing, since the SEMROC version should have
some major differences from the Estes kit.

Night Tripper

03-13-2009, 08:34 PM

Wow! I am out of the loop. Semroc's got a Saturn V on the way?

barone

03-13-2009, 08:45 PM

Hhhhmmmm....wonder if I should try to dump......I mean auction.......mine off before they are released? But, then what if they don't release it? Oh what a quagmire..... :(

dwmzmm

03-13-2009, 08:54 PM

Wow! I am out of the loop. Semroc's got a Saturn V on the way?

From what we can gather, that's the plan. One major difference of the SEMROC kit is the
Apollo capsule will be balsa and the LES tower struts will be, well, wooden dowels. Sort of
like the SEMROC Saturn 1-B & Apollo Little Joe - II Apollo Capsule kit (in other words, a true
Skill Level - 5 build)...... :eek:

Royatl

03-13-2009, 09:12 PM

From what we can gather, that's the plan. One major difference of the SEMROC kit is the
Apollo capsule will be balsa and the LES tower struts will be, well, wooden dowels. Sort of
like the SEMROC Saturn 1-B & Apollo Little Joe - II Apollo Capsule kit (in other words, a true
Skill Level - 5 build)...... :eek:

Ya know, I wonder if you could make a decent tower at that size out of etched metal, the way they make parts like grilles and struts for plastic models?

dwmzmm

03-13-2009, 09:23 PM

Ya know, I wonder if you could make a decent tower at that size out of etched metal, the way they make parts like grilles and struts for plastic models?

I'm sure Carl and company is burning plenty of midnight oil working on this. BTW, I see he's
on this thread as I write this!! :D I think SEMROC will have to look at this from a cost standpoint. I wouldn't mind going the wooden dowel route, so long as the kit is there.
Even though I have two flight ready 1/100 scale Saturn - V's (Estes & Centuri) and two flight
ready Saturn 1-B's (Centuri 1/100 and Estes 1/70), I can always add another to my fleet...... :rolleyes:

Carl@Semroc

03-13-2009, 09:31 PM

I'm sure Carl and company is burning plenty of midnight oil working on this. BTW, I see he's on this thread as I write this!! :DIn between nose cones, laser cuts, and instruction documentation!

I am sure Estes does not have the same design goals that we have, but you can not have too many choices for Saturn V's on the 40th anniversary. :D

luke strawwalker

03-13-2009, 09:42 PM

I'm sure Carl and company is burning plenty of midnight oil working on this. BTW, I see he's
on this thread as I write this!! :D I think SEMROC will have to look at this from a cost standpoint. I wouldn't mind going the wooden dowel route, so long as the kit is there.
Even though I have two flight ready 1/100 scale Saturn - V's (Estes & Centuri) and two flight
ready Saturn 1-B's (Centuri 1/100 and Estes 1/70), I can always add another to my fleet...... :rolleyes:

Dave, does anyone you know of currently make a 1/100 Saturn IB model?? I really wanted a 1/100 Saturn IB and Saturn V, but now I'm thinking of scratchbuilding a BT-80 based Saturn V in 1/150 (roughly) to go alongside a Dr. Zooch Saturn IB, which is roughly 1/150. Even been thinking of downscaling my (as yet unfinished) Ares I 1/100 to 1/150 also... :)

Later! OL JR :)

dwmzmm

03-13-2009, 09:46 PM

In between nose cones, laser cuts, and instruction documentation!

I am sure Estes does not have the same design goals that we have, but you can not have too many choices for Saturn V's on the 40th anniversary. :D

Well, Carl, if Night Tripper's e-mail response from Estes is true (release in July 2009), it'll be
too late to build in case we have an Apollo - 11/Saturn - V Celebration like we had for the
Apollo - 7/Saturn 1-B. Which reminds me, are we having another "plan in the works" like
this? If I'm gonna be involved, I might need a little more time for the build than I had for
the Saturn 1-B project....... :rolleyes: :eek:

dwmzmm

03-13-2009, 09:50 PM

Dave, does anyone you know of currently make a 1/100 Saturn IB model?? I really wanted a 1/100 Saturn IB and Saturn V, but now I'm thinking of scratchbuilding a BT-80 based Saturn V in 1/150 (roughly) to go alongside a Dr. Zooch Saturn IB, which is roughly 1/150. Even been thinking of downscaling my (as yet unfinished) Ares I 1/100 to 1/150 also... :)

Later! OL JR :)

Jeff, I'm not aware of any who make the 1/100 size Saturn 1-B; the closest is Dr. Zooch's
version, which (I might add) looks really good for the price. When I saw the Estes (Centuri
rethread) 1/100 Saturn 1-B at the Maker's Faire in Austin several years back (with some
of the Estes corporate staffs present), I was hoping they'd tell me such a kit was forthcoming, but I got no such tip :( :mad: . You'll really be better off by going with the
SEMROC 1/70th kit, especially if you like to feel a sense of accomplishment of having
"made it through" such a complicated model.

MKP

03-13-2009, 10:03 PM

With all Estes announcements I have learned to live by a motto.

"I'll believe it, when I see it." Estes seems to enjoy teasing us with tidbits, them ripping them away. (e.g. Shrox kits)

sandman

03-13-2009, 10:05 PM

So why does everybody ignore the Peter Alway Saturn V at 1/195th scale? :confused:

It doesn't even get an honorable mention.

It's a beautiful model and only $50 from BMS

Royatl

03-13-2009, 10:10 PM

So why does everybody ignore the Peter Alway Saturn V at 1/195th scale? :confused:

It's a beautiful model and only $50 from BMS

I didn't ignore it! I've only had it for nearly four years! Just like your LTV Scout. And your Nike Hercules (but I have started building that one! Of course there's been no progress on it since October -- it bled off the excess building energy after the Saturn 1b!)

foose4string

03-13-2009, 10:15 PM

MKP

03-13-2009, 10:16 PM

I didn't even know it existed until you mentioned it. Now I'll have to look.

dwmzmm

03-13-2009, 10:18 PM

So why does everybody ignore the Peter Alway Saturn V at 1/195th scale? :confused:

It doesn't even get an honorable mention.

It's a beautiful model and only $50 from BMS

Sorry, forgotten about that one. Hardly see any pictures of the actual model, so maybe that's why it escaped my mind. :o

sandman

03-13-2009, 10:27 PM

I didn't ignore it! I've only had it for nearly four years! Just like your LTV Scout. And your Nike Hercules (but I have started building that one! Of course there's been no progress on it since October -- it bled off the excess building energy after the Saturn 1b!)

Roy, I didn't mean you "personally". :rolleyes:

I meant whenever there is a discussion about the Saturn V and the kits that are available, the Peter Alway kit from BMS is just never or rarely mentioned.

I saw it in the prototype stage and Peter, who is in our club and brought it to a meeting, basically assembled the entire model without glue. It is that precicely made. ;)

Even the body tube is litely etched with a laser to show the location of the detail parts.

Really inovative!

Night Tripper

03-13-2009, 10:27 PM

I was more than a little surprised that Estes would wait until july. If they were gonna cash in on any Apollo fever this year, beyond the usual NASA & rocketry enthusiasts, putting a Saturn V out much earlier would have been a wise decision. 2009 was on the calendar. Didn't they see it coming?

Besides, I was hoping to have one built and ready to fly by this historic july anniversary.

foose4string

03-13-2009, 10:40 PM

but now I'm thinking of scratchbuilding a BT-80 based Saturn V in 1/150 (roughly) to go alongside a Dr. Zooch Saturn IB, which is roughly 1/150

OL JR :)

You see a scratch one from time to time but never a kit. This is one size that is ripe for the taking from a kit makers standpoint. No competition there. Zooch and Alway versions are close in size. Now, it looks like Semroc and Estes might be competing at the same scale. At BT80, you'd get something that is a true "D" flier. C11's would probably work too, or any number of cluster options. Maybe Semroc's will be BT80 after all? I can dream can't I?

But then, does it really matter what size? A Saturn V is just plain cool no matter how you slice it. :)

Royatl

03-13-2009, 11:23 PM

Roy, I didn't mean you "personally".

I know! But I'm just being the exception that proves the rule!

Gus

03-14-2009, 12:36 AM

I saw it in the prototype stage and Peter, who is in our club and brought it to a meeting, basically assembled the entire model without glue. It is that precicely made. ;)

Even the body tube is litely etched with a laser to show the location of the detail parts.

Really inovative!
You've also seen mine, finished. :rolleyes:

Beautiful kit.

tonypv

03-14-2009, 07:23 AM

So why does everybody ignore the Peter Alway Saturn V at 1/195th scale? :confused:

It doesn't even get an honorable mention.

It's a beautiful model and only $50 from BMS

I have one. Beautiful model, as are all of Peters kits.

Gus

03-14-2009, 08:09 AM

I have one. Beautiful model, as are all of Peters kits.Very nice, Tony (yours looks better than mine, so I won't post my photo :o ).

Isn't this a cool kit? Sandman's right, you don't hear much about it. Tons of detail for such a small size. I love how Peter gave the model texture by using thin strips of paper. Very clever. And as Sandman said, the parts fit together flawlessly. Really a very cool model.

JoeLaunchman

03-14-2009, 08:37 AM

Any idea whether the commemorative edition will fly on 1 D12-3 motor like kit#2001 or on 3 C6-3's like K-36? Or could they try something different like a cluster of D's or E's?

luke strawwalker

03-14-2009, 11:39 AM

Jeff, I'm not aware of any who make the 1/100 size Saturn 1-B; the closest is Dr. Zooch's
version, which (I might add) looks really good for the price. When I saw the Estes (Centuri
rethread) 1/100 Saturn 1-B at the Maker's Faire in Austin several years back (with some
of the Estes corporate staffs present), I was hoping they'd tell me such a kit was forthcoming, but I got no such tip :( :mad: . You'll really be better off by going with the
SEMROC 1/70th kit, especially if you like to feel a sense of accomplishment of having
"made it through" such a complicated model.

hehehe... you have a higher opinion of my finances than I do, that's for sure... the Apogee kit is GORGEOUS but TOTALLY out of my price range. I was hoping to eventually make a collection, all in the same scale, or semi-scale, ant scale, or whatever. I agree, the Dr. Zooch kits ARE VERY nice for their size, and especially the price. I like the fact that his Soyuz and Saturn IB are the same scale, and he has such a wide selection. Now if he'd just make BT-80 based Saturn V so it would be in the same scale as the Saturn IB, I'd be a VERY happy camper... :) But scratchbuilding one wouldn't be TOO terribly hard, I think. Others certainly have. I kinda wanted an Ares I and Ares V in the same scale.

I was just wondering, because 1/100 would be a nice scale for all these models, but if nobody's making them, that only leaves doing it by scratchbuilding. That would be a lot tougher, making Soyuz, Saturn IB, etc. in 1/100 scratchbuilt. I still need to finish my 1/100 Ares I though... :)

Anyway, just thinking out loud. I need to get to work on what I have... :) OL JR :)

foose4string

03-14-2009, 12:15 PM

I need to get to work on what I have... :) OL JR :)

That kind of brings things back into perspective, doesn't it? :)

tonypv

03-14-2009, 04:26 PM

Very nice, Tony (yours looks better than mine, so I won't post my photo :o ).

Isn't this a cool kit? Sandman's right, you don't hear much about it. Tons of detail for such a small size. I love how Peter gave the model texture by using thin strips of paper. Very clever. And as Sandman said, the parts fit together flawlessly. Really a very cool model.

Thanks Gus.
Yes it's a very cool kit.
I picked mine up right from Peter at NARAM 46.
Very smooth build. All the laser lines for placement of the details parts were great.

Mark II

03-14-2009, 08:02 PM

Has anyone ever built the Apogee version... or Sheri's?

MarkII

dwmzmm

03-14-2009, 09:29 PM

Has anyone ever built the Apogee version... or Sheri's?

MarkII

Haven't built either one(s), but seen the Apogee kit built by Warren Benson of the NASA/Houston Rocket Club (NAR Section # 365). He converted his to use a cluster of five
engines, a HPR for the core and 24 mm's for the outboards. I think I have some pics taken
by David Laney of one of his launch at JSC several years ago.....

Les

03-14-2009, 09:40 PM

I just need to get building...

I have Dr. Zooch Saturn V, Estes Saturn V (which I am in the process of building), Peter Alway Saturn V, Semroc Saturn 1B, Apogee Saturn 1B and Saturn V, and Sheri's Saturn V. Once I have them all done, it should make an interesting lineup.

Part of my hesitancy in build all these is the skill level required and their cost - I'm afraid of messing them up

dwmzmm

03-14-2009, 09:49 PM

hehehe... you have a higher opinion of my finances than I do, that's for sure... the Apogee kit is GORGEOUS but TOTALLY out of my price range. I was hoping to eventually make a collection, all in the same scale, or semi-scale, ant scale, or whatever. I agree, the Dr. Zooch kits ARE VERY nice for their size, and especially the price. I like the fact that his Soyuz and Saturn IB are the same scale, and he has such a wide selection. Now if he'd just make BT-80 based Saturn V so it would be in the same scale as the Saturn IB, I'd be a VERY happy camper... :) But scratchbuilding one wouldn't be TOO terribly hard, I think. Others certainly have. I kinda wanted an Ares I and Ares V in the same scale.

I was just wondering, because 1/100 would be a nice scale for all these models, but if nobody's making them, that only leaves doing it by scratchbuilding. That would be a lot tougher, making Soyuz, Saturn IB, etc. in 1/100 scratchbuilt. I still need to finish my 1/100 Ares I though... :)

Anyway, just thinking out loud. I need to get to work on what I have... :) OL JR :)

Ugh, Jeff, please re-read my post prior to yours; I don't think I mentioned the Apogee kit (yes, it's pretty expensive, but from what I can gather, very, very detailed. The SEMROC
version is very reasonable cost-wise and can also be very detailed depending on the level
of craftsmanship you put into it). Personally, I would LOVE to have both the Apogee &
Sheri's Hot Rockets Saturns, but they're also out of range of my budget :( . Also Sirius
Rocketry's Saturn - V is very nice looking (see the article in LAUNCH on the build of this model)..... :)

Ltvscout

03-14-2009, 10:25 PM

Also Sirius Rocketry's Saturn - V is very nice looking (see the article in LAUNCH on the build of this model)..... :)
You beat me to it mentioning this kit. Yes, Dave at Sirius also has an excellent Saturn V. You can see it/order it from here:

http://www.siriusrocketry.com/eshop/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21&products_id=28

Gus

03-15-2009, 12:58 AM

Estes, Semroc, Peter Alway, Dr. Zooch, Sirius, Sheri...

Man, it's like I'm the only person left who isn't offering a Saturn V kit. :rolleyes:

I feel so....... negligent. ;)

chanstevens

03-15-2009, 06:23 AM

So why does everybody ignore the Peter Alway Saturn V at 1/195th scale? :confused:

It doesn't even get an honorable mention.

It's a beautiful model and only $50 from BMS

Some of us didn't ;)

http://www.rocketreviews.com/reviews/special/saturn_comparison.shtml

I'd love to add a Semroc version to that list or even a re-released Estes. Down the road I plan on doing bigger ones (Sirius, Sheri's) but since our club lost our field any thoughts of HPR have been put deep on the backburner.

dwmzmm

03-15-2009, 09:02 AM

Some of us didn't ;)

http://www.rocketreviews.com/reviews/special/saturn_comparison.shtml

I'd love to add a Semroc version to that list or even a re-released Estes. Down the road I plan on doing bigger ones (Sirius, Sheri's) but since our club lost our field any thoughts of HPR have been put deep on the backburner.

Well, you could always go ahead and then come down here and fly yours (the Sirius/Sheri's)
at our launch site in Needville, TX :D :rolleyes:

spacecenturion

03-15-2009, 04:11 PM

I wrote them a while ago asking about if they could/would re-release the Saturn V, never heard from them! :rolleyes: I guess they have been getting a lot of these emails from all of us!

The big question is, which kit do you think it will be? I am assuming the last one they had out, #2157 I believe, the Estes/Centuri hybrid model.

Looks like this is going to be a good year!!! A lot of Saturn V's out there!!!

And yes, I do plan on buying the Semroc Sat V too!

Shreadvector

03-16-2009, 07:55 AM

Any idea whether the commemorative edition will fly on 1 D12-3 motor like kit#2001 or on 3 C6-3's like K-36? Or could they try something different like a cluster of D's or E's?

I'm guessing it will fly on the new E18-4 motor.

;)

timorley

03-16-2009, 04:35 PM

You see a scratch one from time to time but never a kit. This is one size that is ripe for the taking from a kit makers standpoint. No competition there. Zooch and Alway versions are close in size. Now, it looks like Semroc and Estes might be competing at the same scale. At BT80, you'd get something that is a true "D" flier. C11's would probably work too, or any number of cluster options. Maybe Semroc's will be BT80 after all? I can dream can't I?

But then, does it really matter what size? A Saturn V is just plain cool no matter how you slice it. :)

It was fun scratch building a BT-80 version.I did a build thread on TRF last year before the database crash. It's not scale, but there were some interesting things to figure out. I have an Estes already, I like the Sat V, I remember the launches and moon landings when I was a kid. I'll likely get at least Semroc's. The Peter Alway kit does look pretty cool, I'll have to look into it. Can't have too many Saturn V's, although my wife might think otherwise.

foose4string

03-16-2009, 04:44 PM

It was fun scratch building a BT-80 version.I did a build thread on TRF last year before the database crash. It's not scale, but there were some interesting things to figure out. I have an Estes already, I like the Sat V, I remember the launches and moon landings when I was a kid. I'll likely get at least Semroc's. The Peter Alway kit does look pretty cool, I'll have to look into it. Can't have too many Saturn V's, although my wife might think otherwise.

That may not be scale, but that looks as good as(or better) than any kit built Saturn V as I've seen. I enjoyed watching that build thread and hope to try and copy what you did some day. It's too bad that went down, I was hoping to reference it when the time came. I only remember seeing it on TRF, did you cross post it here? Have you flown it yet?

luke strawwalker

03-16-2009, 07:01 PM

I'll second Foose's thoughts here... I read that thread with GREAT interest and the results were TOP NOTCH!

If you still have the build photos, would you consider re-constructing the thread on TRF?? Well, and here for that matter... I've learned my lesson and I just go on and crosspost everything to TRF, YORF, and RP. Gotta be a REAL BAD day on the internet for all three to go up in smoke!

Hope you can enlighten us... (again!) OL JR :)

rosko_racer

03-16-2009, 07:17 PM

Some time ago, January 24 2007, I got a package from Estes with plastic NCs, a replacement set for a Gauchito, a MR capsule set, and a complete plastic set for the Saturn V... I wanted more but they said they could only sell me one. The set is still in the plastic bag waiting for either a scratchbuilt or to be used on Semroc's Sat V if it they are the same scale and it does not have the plastic parts...

timorley

03-16-2009, 09:31 PM

timorley

03-16-2009, 09:46 PM

That may not be scale, but that looks as good as(or better) than any kit built Saturn V as I've seen. I enjoyed watching that build thread and hope to try and copy what you did some day. It's too bad that went down, I was hoping to reference it when the time came. I only remember seeing it on TRF, did you cross post it here? Have you flown it yet?

Thank you very much!

I was afraid you were going to ask that,. :) Frustratingly, no, it hasn't flown yet. I've taken it to a field a couple times and aborted over wind. It's a two piece recovery, and I didn't want to be foolish on it's first flight given the amount of work I put in it. Weather permitting, I'm going to try again Easter weekend. My dad watched the Apollo missions with me and he's as anxious as I to see it go up. Plus the farm fields at my dad's are clear now, so I can go to the bigger field.

rosko_racer

03-16-2009, 10:10 PM

Timorley, that is one awesome looking SAT V. What did you use for the wraps? Corrugated cardstock?

timorley

03-17-2009, 09:22 AM

Timorley, that is one awesome looking SAT V. What did you use for the wraps? Corrugated cardstock?

Yep, I used a corrugated cardstock. It gave the effect I was looking for.

georgegassaway

03-17-2009, 09:00 PM

http://www.rocketreviews.com/reviews/special/saturn_comparison.shtml

Uh-Oh, "I Dream Of Jennie" rocket identification syndrome.

That "Saturn-V" photo on the left (Apogee) is the most out-of-scale Saturn-V I have ever seen a photo of. The 1st and 2nd stages are the same diamter as the S-IVB stage. And it looks like..... a cluster of... "tanks", and eight fins instead of four fins?

Though it sure looks great if it was listed as a Saturn-IB.......

- George Gassaway

spacecenturion

03-17-2009, 09:12 PM

Hey everyone.....I mentioned earlier that I wrote Estes a while back, and I finally got an answer from them...I quote:
-------------------------------------
Hi Michael,

One of my directors has told me that the 40th anniversary edition is due
out this coming July...watch the website for availability and pricing.

Best regards,
Customer Service.
---------------------------------------

I guess we just have to watch the website to see the details and such!

Intruder

03-17-2009, 09:13 PM

Yep, I used a corrugated cardstock. It gave the effect I was looking for.
Where did you get it. I'd love to get my hands on some.

dwmzmm

03-17-2009, 09:17 PM

Where did you get it. I'd love to get my hands on some.

You can get corrugated card stock from SEMROC; that's what I did :D .

Mark II

03-17-2009, 09:23 PM

Uh-Oh, "I Dream Of Jennie" rocket identification syndrome.

That "Saturn-V" photo on the left (Apogee) is the most out-of-scale Saturn-V I have ever seen a photo of. The 1st and 2nd stages are the same diamter as the S-IVB stage. And it looks like..... a cluster of... "tanks", and eight fins instead of four fins?

Though it sure looks great if it was listed as a Saturn-IB.......

- George Gassaway
OOPS!... :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:

(And there but for the grace of God go I...)

MarkII

tbzep

03-18-2009, 07:27 AM

You can get corrugated card stock from SEMROC; that's what I did :D .

Intruder has some Little Joe II wraps he used for another project. We thought maybe it was available somewhere like a craft store.

dwmzmm

03-18-2009, 07:50 AM

Intruder has some Little Joe II wraps he used for another project. We thought maybe it was available somewhere like a craft store.

Yes, I know. Tried looking for those (corrugated paper) at Hobby Lobby & Michael's a while
back when I was in dire need myself. Ended up hand making them myself then (didn't know
at the time SEMROC sold them separately from the kits).

BTW, I put the grinning face at the end of my previous post as I saw Carl of SEMROC was viewing this thread as I was about to post..... :p

Night Tripper

03-18-2009, 09:34 AM

Apollo seems to be the theme of the day. I just got my latest issue of Sport Rocketry yesterday. I love the Saturn V on the cover! I haven't read much of it. But, the article on the FLARE was great.

luke strawwalker

03-18-2009, 11:42 AM

Yes, I know. Tried looking for those (corrugated paper) at Hobby Lobby & Michael's a while
back when I was in dire need myself. Ended up hand making them myself then (didn't know
at the time SEMROC sold them separately from the kits).

BTW, I put the grinning face at the end of my previous post as I saw Carl of SEMROC was viewing this thread as I was about to post..... :p

That's certainly good to know!!! I FINALLY found some of that corrugated paper last year in Indiana, at a scrapbooking store my wife and SIL went to. I bought like ten sheets of it. Pretty nice stuff, on heavy cardstock. Nice embossed pattern.

I've only found some pretty coarse corrugated paper in BLACK at Michael's off the SW freeway near HWY 6 in Houston... the corrugations looked too big to be useful for anything but a LARGE scale model, though, in which case you'd probably use plastruct or balsa strips anyway. My SIL gave me a paper corrugating machine she had for scrapbooking that she got at Michaels or one of the crafty stores, and it's ok... sorta like a foot long pair of gears that you feed the paper through as you turn the handle, and it corrugates the paper, but the corrugations are too coarse... What I need is a pair of model car gears say a foot long-- the fine teeth would make EXCELLENT corrugations!

I've even tinkered with the idea of using two pieces of all-thread rod meshing together to corrugate paper fed between them. The spiral of the threads would be troublesome, but you could cut your corrugated section out of the paper at an angle so they'd be square to the edges... if it works... have to go tinker in the shop pretty soon...

Later! OL JR :)

timorley

03-18-2009, 02:38 PM

Where did you get it. I'd love to get my hands on some.

I got it at a Michaels craft store. It came in 12x12 sheets and was about a $1 I think. Not all the Michaels I've been to have it. It was labeled Corduroy. When I re-post the build thread I have a picture of the paper and the label on it. I originally was looking at corrugated styrene, even bought several different sizes, but finally settled on this because it was light, easy to work with and looked just fine given I didn't care about scale. For the engine fairings I experimented with dimensional fabric paint on sticker paper, that came out pretty good too.

foose4string

03-19-2009, 09:10 AM

I got it at a Michaels craft store. It came in 12x12 sheets and was about a $1 I think. Not all the Michaels I've been to have it. It was labeled Corduroy. When I re-post the build thread I have a picture of the paper and the label on it. I originally was looking at corrugated styrene, even bought several different sizes, but finally settled on this because it was light, easy to work with and looked just fine given I didn't care about scale. For the engine fairings I experimented with dimensional fabric paint on sticker paper, that came out pretty good too.

I got bought the same exact stuff from Michaels a year or more ago, located with all the scrapbooking paper. Receipt was still in the bag. 79 cents for a 12 X 12 sheet of "Corduroy". I also bought a couple sheets of "Corrugated" from Michaels made by the same company.... "The Paper Company". That's the sheet you see layer under the Corduroy in the photo. The "Corrugated" has deeper, wider, evenly spaced, grooves. It would be perfect for an Orion or large Saturn. It was 99 cent per 12 X 12 inch.

There is yet another corrugated cardstock I found a couple years ago at AC Moore(which is like a Michaels). They were having big sale on scrapbook paper, 75 percent off. They ended up being 15 cents for a 12 X 12 inch! I bought several sheets. :) That stuff has a very tight, and fairly shallow corrugation. It's too small to be used on something like a BT80 Saturn but would probably look great on a BT60 Saturn. This is identical to the stuff Dr. Zooch uses for the ET on his shuttle kit. He was using corrugated mylar, but switched over to this stuff once I showed it to him.

It's out there, but I'm sure the available stock varies from store to store. The SKU numbers should help track it down.

rokitflite

03-20-2009, 08:33 AM

And by the way, Craig's scrapbooking skills are second to none! Many a time while we're out there launching we realize Craig is nowhere to be found. We go inside to find him feverishly cutting away at little bits of shiny, colorful paper and the smell of hot glue fills the house. We all have a good laugh and say "Oh Craig, you and those scrapbooks". He smiles a guilty little smile then he fixes us all a cup of hot chocolate that we sip while we watch him happily attach photographs and dried flowers from the field found at previous launches. Foose4string... Hes not just about rockets. ;)

InFlight

03-20-2009, 09:57 AM

And by the way, Craig's scrapbooking skills are second to none! Many a time while we're out there launching we realize Craig is nowhere to be found. We go inside to find him feverishly cutting away at little bits of shiny, colorful paper and the smell of hot glue fills the house. We all have a good laugh and say "Oh Craig, you and those scrapbooks". He smiles a guilty little smile then he fixes us all a cup of hot choclate that we sip while we watch him happily attach photographs and dried flowers from the field found at previous launches. Foose4string... Hes not just about rockets. ;)
ROFL :chuckle:

foose4string

03-20-2009, 01:33 PM

And by the way, Craig's scrapbooking skills are second to none! Many a time while we're out there launching we realize Craig is nowhere to be found. We go inside to find him feverishly cutting away at little bits of shiny, colorful paper and the smell of hot glue fills the house. We all have a good laugh and say "Oh Craig, you and those scrapbooks". He smiles a guilty little smile then he fixes us all a cup of hot choclate that we sip while we watch him happily attach photographs and dried flowers from the field found at previous launches. Foose4string... Hes not just about rockets. ;)

:chuckle: Too funny. :chuckle:

BTW, I'm not finished with those rubber stamps and beading supplies you lent me.

Doctor-X

03-27-2009, 06:16 AM

For those with curiosity, the Estes Saturn V kit is being re-engineered. The Apollo capasule and tower are all new tooling, as well as all new vacuum forms, all of which are corrected to the SA-506 version. There are several new additional scale kits in the works as well.

foose4string

03-27-2009, 06:31 AM

Welcome to YORF Doctor X. :) Glad to have you aboard. I am looking forward to seeing the scale offerings, including the Saturn V.

sandman

03-27-2009, 08:07 AM

Doctor-X

03-27-2009, 08:29 AM

What is it you would like to know?

foose4string

03-27-2009, 08:31 AM

When do you expect the new Saturn to be released? What other scale kits? Atlas? Pershing? Ares? Do tell. :)

Doctor-X

03-27-2009, 08:40 AM

dwmzmm

03-27-2009, 09:25 AM

Wow, Doctor - X, welcome aboard and nice to see you're here. We're always interested in
learning the new and the old in this forum. Should be very interesting.

tbzep

03-27-2009, 10:37 AM

Are you related to Dr. Who?

Doctor-X

03-27-2009, 11:34 AM

no, never played for them.....

Eagle3

03-27-2009, 11:50 AM

The Estes folks are working hard to have the V being targeted to be released for the 40th anniversary Apollo 11 launch. If that's missed, it won't be the fault of the Estes staff - the fault will fall on the shoulders of the part vendors.

There are some terrific models in the works - 3 in addition to the V. You're going to like what they are.

Welcome Dr. X, It's great to see you posting. :)

Is there anything regarding the new Saturn V and how it differs from previous releases you can tell us?

Gus

03-27-2009, 12:13 PM

Doctor-X,

Welcome aboard.

I'm really glad to hear about the Saturn V and possible other kits.

Estes has produced a host of wonderful scale kits over the years so this is really good news!

When you can share more, please let us know.

And again, welcome to the forum. Information from Estes is always much appreciated here.

Night Tripper

03-27-2009, 07:32 PM

stefanj

03-28-2009, 01:03 AM

D'oh! What am I going to do with the two 1999 Saturn Vs I have? :-)

dwmzmm

03-28-2009, 01:10 AM

D'oh! What am I going to do with the two 1999 Saturn Vs I have? :-)

Build both; one for display and one for flying :D ;) :rolleyes:

snaquin

03-28-2009, 08:49 AM

Mindcrime

conleyt

03-28-2009, 02:43 PM

Mindcrime

Wonder how many people will get the reference....... :D

Tom C.

foose4string

03-28-2009, 05:34 PM

Wonder how many people will get the reference....... :D

Tom C.

As in... Operation?

Dr. X - the man with the cure. ;)

Great albumn.

pantherjon

03-29-2009, 07:41 AM

D'oh! What am I going to do with the two 1999 Saturn Vs I have? :-)

Well, I would gladly lighten your load and take one! :p :chuckle:

stefanj

03-29-2009, 05:16 PM

Build both; one for display and one for flying :D ;) :rolleyes:

I already have one for display and one for flying. I'm talking about two EXTRAS.

dwmzmm

03-29-2009, 05:24 PM

I already have one for display and one for flying. I'm talking about two EXTRAS.

Ok, in that case you can "give" one to me...... :D :rolleyes:

pantherjon

03-30-2009, 07:27 AM

Ok, in that case you can "give" one to me...... :D :rolleyes:

And I will gladly accept his 2nd 'extra'! :chuckle:

Back on topic: I HOPE this happens, and if it does, I plan on getting a couple or three! ;)

Jeff Walther

03-30-2009, 11:13 AM

D'oh! What am I going to do with the two 1999 Saturn Vs I have? :-)

Fly them. And be happy that if they meet with disaster there are/will-be new affordable replacements available, instead of hunting rare copies on Ebay.

I have three Saturn Vs in the boxes I bought on Ebay this past year, two of which are older K-31s (the dual part numbered version). But I'm happy as a clam that the Saturn Vs are being (re-) released. It means that a loss will be easily replaced--well, except for all that building and painting of course.

Now with all this discussion, I just hope I can finish planking the attic and get things cleaned up fast enough to clear my work bench early enough to have time to build the Saturn Vs before the anniversary of the launch date...

Thomas Malthouse

04-01-2009, 09:16 AM

I will buy any Saturn V that is less than $40 and can handle an E18 (I love that white lightning). That's either the Semroc or the Estes. The thing is, I'd be able to get the Estes from the LHS but the Semroc kit would be better. :confused:

ghrocketman

04-01-2009, 09:44 AM

Under $40 ???
C'mon now...Let's be REAL here...the ONLY Saturn V you will get at that price point is the very-semi scale Dr.Zooch kit.
Forget about a 3.5' x 4" behemoth flying on 24/29mm power at that price.
The parts cost to produce the kit alone would probably cost that.

barone

04-01-2009, 01:16 PM

(snip)......The parts cost to produce the kit alone would probably cost that.
And that probably doesn't include any detailing....... :rolleyes:

dwmzmm

04-01-2009, 05:51 PM

And that probably doesn't include any detailing....... :rolleyes:

You can always do the detailing on your own; that's what I've been doing on my Saturn's
lately....... :D

Pem Tech

07-03-2009, 11:47 AM

You can get corrugated card stock from SEMROC; that's what I did :D .

You mean these embossed wraps?
Semroc Wraps (http://www.semroc.com/Store/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=93)

dwmzmm

07-03-2009, 04:09 PM

You mean these embossed wraps?
Semroc Wraps (http://www.semroc.com/Store/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=93)

Yes, those. I got the set for the Apollo Little Joe - II. The wraps can be cut to size.....

Night Tripper

07-21-2009, 11:15 PM

Well...it's finally July.

Hey Estes! Where's that Saturn V?

rokitflite

07-22-2009, 08:39 AM

Well...it's finally July.

Hey Estes! Where's that Saturn V?

Right behind you in your Avatar picture... Duh! :rolleyes:

:D :D :D

kurtschachner

07-22-2009, 09:04 AM

Right behind you in your Avatar picture... Duh! :rolleyes:

:D :D :D

Yeah, I can't believe you lost THAT!

Carl@Semroc

07-22-2009, 09:22 AM

Right behind you in your Avatar picture... Duh! :rolleyes:

:D :D :DI did not know that Estes made one that big! Looks like full scale.

tbzep

07-22-2009, 10:22 AM

I did not know that Estes made one that big! Looks like full scale.

It helps them sell more D12's for clustering. ;)

GregGleason

07-22-2009, 11:26 AM

I did not know that Estes made one that big! Looks like full scale.

The tube looks to me to be about a BT-8000.

:D

Greg

Mark II

07-22-2009, 05:31 PM

The tube looks to me to be about a BT-8000.

:D

Greg
Wrong! It's actually a BT-8001. :D :chuckle:

MarkII

GregGleason

07-22-2009, 05:34 PM

Wrong! It's actually a BT-8001. :D :chuckle:

MarkII

:chuckle:

You know, I actually went back and forth with that. I guess the ol' eyes aren't what they used to be!

:D

Greg

Molniya

09-26-2009, 06:51 AM

I e-mailed Estes customer service earlier this week. Interestingly enough, the reply was marked as SPAM by my server ! In any case, it would appear that the 40th Anniversary release will be delayed for quite some time...alas ! See below:

Paul,

We had planned to bring the SV back in time for the 40th anniversary launch. However, the plastic tooling for the Saturn is over 40 years old and we could not get any decent parts from the tools. We have redesigned the parts, but are having trouble getting consistent production runs of the plastic parts. This has been most frustrating to us as well. I would guess that if we can get the plastic parts up to our quality standards, then the rest of the kit is pretty easy to complete. However, I would suggest that you not look for it until next year - perhaps even later.

Regards,
Mike Fritz
Estes-Cox Corporation

ghrocketman

09-26-2009, 07:59 AM

What a joke.
Estes should have planned this project with PLENTY of lead time to ensure all the kinks were worked out to actually hit a release target of the 40th anniversary.
All we EVER hear from Estes are excuses and delays.
Mamby-pamby lead-law excuses for delays on the bring back of classic kits, yadda, yadda.
They can't even use that lame one for the delay in bringing back the A8-0 and A10-0T.
Estes has not even bothered with an excuse for that one.
I seriously wish someone would just take over the Estes SU BP motor production so I could completely DUMP them and their sorry perpetual excuses.

cas2047

09-26-2009, 08:31 AM

Thanks for the update Paul. I've been hoping this one would be released soon, but it appears that it's just not going to happen. I'm glad Semroc is coming out with their version soon. I'm sure it will be on par with what Estes will be releasing someday, and a challenging and rewarding build.

rokitflite

09-26-2009, 08:49 AM

We had planned to bring the SV back in time for the 40th anniversary launch. However, the plastic tooling for the Saturn is over 40 years old and we could not get any decent parts from the tools. We have redesigned the parts, but are having trouble getting consistent production runs of the plastic parts. This has been most frustrating to us as well. I would guess that if we can get the plastic parts up to our quality standards, then the rest of the kit is pretty easy to complete. However, I would suggest that you not look for it until next year - perhaps even later.

Regards,
Mike Fritz
Estes-Cox Corporation

Wow! I am SOOOO surprised that this did not make it out when they said it would.

Night Tripper

09-27-2009, 12:37 AM

" However, I would suggest that you not look for it until next year - perhaps even later."

Translation: Not coming out.

Thank goodness for SEMROC. I'll still be eagerly awaiting the arrival of their Saturn V.

ghrocketman

09-28-2009, 09:39 AM

Like I said, they are a JOKE.
If it was not for their almost complete monopoly on EASILY obtainable, REASONABLY priced single-use BP engines, they would have been getting ZERO $$$ from me long ago.

metlfreak

10-04-2009, 01:09 PM

Like I said, they are a JOKE.
If it was not for their almost complete monopoly on EASILY obtainable, REASONABLY priced single-use BP engines, they would have been getting ZERO $$$ from me long ago.
Now that I think about it, it has been years since I have baught anything from estes Except motors. Though I did go on a composite rocketry benge as a teenager....that was when Estes rocket line really slimed in the late 90s.
Dont get me wrong here I am a huge estes fan but man they have got to better as far as kits go and motors really.

Mikus

10-05-2009, 02:47 PM

We had planned to bring the SV back in time for the 40th anniversary launch. However, the plastic tooling for the Saturn is over 40 years old and we could not get any decent parts from the tools. We have redesigned the parts, but are having trouble getting consistent production runs of the plastic parts. This has been most frustrating to us as well. I would guess that if we can get the plastic parts up to our quality standards, then the rest of the kit is pretty easy to complete. However, I would suggest that you not look for it until next year - perhaps even later.

Regards,
Mike Fritz
Estes-Cox Corporation

Meh, a show of hands from anybody shocked at this statement. Yah, I didn't think there would be many. :mad:

Hey, they've got a great start on the 2019 festivities. :chuckle:

GregGleason

10-05-2009, 03:51 PM

What is interesting about the reply from Estes-Cox is that it is similar to another conversation I had about a week ago. I was on a church retreat and one of the guys that attended it works for NASA. When the topic of the Saturn V came up, he said it would be hard to reproduce it today since a lot of the engineering data no longer exists. It's very sad that we essentially stenciled "ABANDON IN PLACE" on much of the technology and personnel that our country spent so much treasure, even blood, to obtain.

Greg

kurtschachner

10-05-2009, 04:06 PM

It is somewhat of an urban legend that "all the blueprints for the Saturn V were lost". That's an oversimplification of the truth, but here's a good article about what the problem really is:

http://www.thespacereview.com/article/588/1

Oh, and here's a related article, not about the Saturn V but about the Space Shuttle:

http://blogs.nasa.gov/cm/blog/waynehalesblog/posts/post_1219932905350.html

What is interesting about the reply from Estes-Cox is that it is similar to another conversation I had about a week ago. I was on a church retreat and one of the guys that attended it works for NASA. When the topic of the Saturn V came up, he said it would be hard to reproduce it today since a lot of the engineering data no longer exists. It's very sad that we essentially stenciled "ABANDON IN PLACE" on much of the technology and personnel that our country spent so much treasure, even blood, to obtain.

Greg

metlfreak

10-07-2009, 12:35 AM

I wonder if we will ever see the rerelease of the mercury atlantis.

Shreadvector

10-07-2009, 06:34 AM

I wonder if we will ever see the rerelease of the mercury atlantis.

The Mercury Atlantis was cancelled, but the new Mercury Universe premiered last week.

:p

tbzep

10-07-2009, 08:13 AM

I wonder if we will ever see the rerelease of the mercury atlantis.

That's what Gus Grissom should have named his Mercury capsule. :eek: :p

GregGleason

10-07-2009, 08:30 AM

That's what Gus Grissom should have named his Mercury capsule. :eek: :p

:chuckle: :chuckle:

Wouldn't that make Gus The Space Man From Atlantis?

Greg

tbzep

10-07-2009, 09:19 AM

:chuckle: :chuckle:

Wouldn't that make Gus The Space Man From Atlantis?

Greg

And Patrick Duffy would have played him in "The Right Stuff". :p

Jeff Walther

10-07-2009, 09:55 AM

It is somewhat of an urban legend that "all the blueprints for the Saturn V were lost". That's an oversimplification of the truth, but here's a good article about what the problem really is:

http://www.thespacereview.com/article/588/1

Kurt, thanks for the great info. That is an interesting article. I have occasionally had discussions on various sci fi lists with folks who think you can just stick all of human knowledge in a library and recreate an industrial society from it (context being colonization or post-apocalypse). There's a huge amount of art to any process which is lost when the practitioners are lost and is usually not recorded because it's not part of the "official" process. There's always something the workers know which isn't written down.

kurtschachner

10-07-2009, 09:56 PM

Kurt, thanks for the great info. That is an interesting article. I have occasionally had discussions on various sci fi lists with folks who think you can just stick all of human knowledge in a library and recreate an industrial society from it (context being colonization or post-apocalypse). There's a huge amount of art to any process which is lost when the practitioners are lost and is usually not recorded because it's not part of the "official" process. There's always something the workers know which isn't written down.

That is a good article. Most all of them on The Space Review are. What I found most interesting was the concept that really you couldn't - and wouldn't - build a Saturn V today anyway. At least not like you did in 1969 as this paragraph points out (emphasis mine):

If NASA wanted to build a new Saturn 5 today, the agency would not want nor need the original blueprints. They would want to, and would have to, do things differently. They would want to develop computer-assisted drawings of the pieces, for starters. And they could build pieces lighter and stronger than in 1966. The plans, the blueprints that the agency “lost,” would not be all that useful in developing similar equipment using technology that has evolved and improved over four decades.

That's an ongoing problem with many old technologies. When our airline was flying DC-9 and MD-80 aircraft there were LOTS of components and "black boxes" that were designed in the '60s (and '50s!) that were a real bear to get repaired 40 years later. In many cases nobody - and I mean nobody - made the piece parts anymore. Many suppliers relied on cannibalizing scrapped components for the needed parts since no new ones were being manufactured. This also included many sealants, adhesives and insulating materials that just no longer existed. Wayne Hale mentions this in his blog post as well. It's quite a problem for NASA.

Anyway, slow evolution is the way to go and of course that's not gonna happen today. The world has moved on and the Saturn V was left behind forty long years ago. Heck I can't even hardly operate a 10-year old computer!