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-   -   Testors non-toxic cement for plastic models (http://www.oldrocketforum.com/showthread.php?t=12501)

blackshire 05-13-2013 10:12 PM

Testors non-toxic cement for plastic models
 
Hello All,

The Testors non-toxic (tube-type) cement for plastic models (it comes in an "alicorn lightning pale blue" tube) came up in Reply #10 in *this* thread about the Estes Generic E2X bulk kit changes (see: http://www.oldrocketforum.com/showt...2903#post162903 ). I haven't used this cement myself, but I have been told by a local hobby shop owner that while it is lousy at bonding plastic, it is a good paper-to-paper and paper-to-wood cement. This got me ruminating on the following:

If this cement has physical characteristics (when dry) that are like those of the regular tube-type Testors cement for plastic models (and its equivalents made by other manufacturers), it might have several very convenient model rocketry applications (including in school and youth group model rocketry programs). These include:

[1] "Plastic sanding sealer & balsa wood grain filler"; The cement could be brushed (or "squeegeed," using a piece of scrap balsa) onto balsa fins and nose cones, being sanded smooth after the cement dried. This should also strengthen those parts as well as make their surfaces more dent-resistant.

[2] "Paper laminating glue for balsa fins"; White glue and yellow glue work well for cementing laminating paper to balsa fins, but these glues' moisture content can cause the paper to expand and bulge outward, creating little domes on the paper skins. If the Testors non-toxic cement for plastic models does not cause this problem with paper, it would be a good substitute for white and yellow glues for laminating fins. If so, the Testors cement could also be used to apply thin, moisture-resistant "film" coatings to parts of rockets (such as the lower ends of motor mount tubes, for example) that tend to get wet when flying on damp, grassy fields.

[3] This cement might be useful (particularly on small rockets) for balsa-to-paper joints such as balsa fins glued onto kraft paper body tubes, as well as paper-to-paper joints such as launch lugs glued onto body tubes. It might also work for gluing motor mounts and thrust rings into body tubes, although given the heat of the motor ejection charge it would probably be best to reserve these glue joints for white glue or yellow glue.

I hope this information will be helpful.

ghrocketman 05-14-2013 09:42 AM

The Testors Blue-Tube Plastic cement contains d-Limonene as the main bonding agent.
It is LOUSY for EVERYTHING.
You would be much better off using Green or Yellow Tube Testors WOOD Cement for a sealer or for bonding paper skins to fins.
Put the Blue Tube glue where it belongs. In the GARBAGE CAN.

jetlag 05-14-2013 09:58 AM

Agree with GH completely!

The green tube that is the wood glue sucks badly as well. It is terrible in that it has little bonding strength and becomes brittle once dry.
Much better alternatives exist to the Testor's adhesives; why they maintain these ridiculously awful formulations is a mystery to me. They all suck massively, and I refuse to use them anymore.
They all should be pulled from the market in my opinion.

Allen

blackshire 05-14-2013 10:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
The Testors Blue-Tube Plastic cement contains d-Limonene as the main bonding agent.
It is LOUSY for EVERYTHING.
You would be much better off using Green or Yellow Tube Testors WOOD Cement for a sealer or for bonding paper skins to fins.
Put the Blue Tube glue where it belongs. In the GARBAGE CAN.
Last night I ordered a 5/8 ounce tube of it, and I'm going to try it (on scrap balsa) as a wood grain filler and as a paper laminating glue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetlag
Agree with GH completely!

The green tube that is the wood glue sucks badly as well. It is terrible in that it has little bonding strength and becomes brittle once dry.
Much better alternatives exist to the Testor's adhesives; why they maintain these ridiculously awful formulations is a mystery to me. They all suck massively, and I refuse to use them anymore.
They all should be pulled from the market in my opinion.
I agree, but for my limited proposed application the brittleness shouldn't be a problem. My first choice would be the orange-tube Testors "toxic cement for plastic models" < :-) > as an experimental wood grain filler and laminating glue, but I figured I'd try the blue-tube variety simply because it (hopefully) isn't as unpleasantly aromatic as the orange-tube stuff.

jetlag 05-14-2013 11:07 AM

Please report back your results! I'm always on the lookout for a better use for something.
I've exhausted the normal uses for these adhesives; I'd love to know a good alternative use other than the thrash can! :D

Allen

ghrocketman 05-14-2013 01:15 PM

Blackshire, BITE YOUR TONGUE ! Orange tube is PLEASANTLY aromatic, NOT UNpleasantly.
Actually the Orange tube stuff only has about 1/2 the Toluene it used to. I literally squeeze the tube out into a jar and mix it with about 1/2oz of Toluene and apply it with a micro-brush for bonding plastics. It then works like the same cement from the 40's through late 80's.
Buying any size tube of the Testors blue-tube cement at ANY price is a total waste of money.
If one uses the green-tube or yellow-tube wood glue as described in the directions, they will at least form a serviceable bond. The blue-tube stuff is good for nothing but maybe a campfire-starter gel.

tbzep 05-14-2013 03:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
Blackshire, BITE YOUR TONGUE ! Orange tube is PLEASANTLY aromatic, NOT UNpleasantly.
Actually the Orange tube stuff only has about 1/2 the Toluene it used to. I literally squeeze the tube out into a jar and mix it with about 1/2oz of Toluene and apply it with a micro-brush for bonding plastics.


I agree on the aroma, and the weakened state of modern orange tube stuff! Tick? What tick?

blackshire 05-15-2013 07:31 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jetlag
Please report back your results! I'm always on the lookout for a better use for something.
I've exhausted the normal uses for these adhesives; I'd love to know a good alternative use other than the thrash can! :D

Allen
I shall do that! In addition to balsa/paper lamination tests, I also have a few odds-and-ends balsa nose cones that I'll try it on, as a wood grain filler. The owner of the local "Model's Enterprise" hobby shop didn't "sing this cements' praises" to me (because it *isn't* good at what it's intended for--bonding plastic), but he did say that other customers had found it unexpectedly useful for bonding applications in paper art (creating scenes, collages, etc.). They found that unlike white and yellow glue, the Testors non-toxic cement didn't cause wrinkles in paper media. Also:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
Blackshire, BITE YOUR TONGUE ! Orange tube is PLEASANTLY aromatic, NOT UNpleasantly. Actually the Orange tube stuff only has about 1/2 the Toluene it used to. I literally squeeze the tube out into a jar and mix it with about 1/2oz of Toluene and apply it with a micro-brush for bonding plastics. It then works like the same cement from the 40's through late 80's.
Buying any size tube of the Testors blue-tube cement at ANY price is a total waste of money. If one uses the green-tube or yellow-tube wood glue as described in the directions, they will at least form a serviceable bond. The blue-tube stuff is good for nothing but maybe a campfire-starter gel.
When I was younger, none of the volatile-rich model cements that we all grew up using (Testors, Pactra, Ambroid, etc.) bothered me--not even the Testors liquid plastic cement (MEK [Methyl-Ethyl Ketone]). As I have gotten older, though, my lungs and sinuses have become sensitized to them. The scent of them doesn't bother me and never did, but the shortness of breath, tightness in the chest, and sinus irritation that they now cause are quite unpleasant. As well:
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbzep
I agree on the aroma, and the weakened state of modern orange tube stuff! Tick? What tick?
About forty years ago, one day I was trying to squeeze a "clot" of dried Testors cement (the orange-tube kind) out of the tube's neck, so that I could use the cement to build a model kit. Well, the tube gave way before the "clot" did, and all of the cement squirted onto my bare leg (I was wearing shorts at the time). Even though I wiped it off within less than thirty seconds (I went to get a paper towel), it caused the strangest tingly, firey itch, and the skin where the cement went felt hot and cold at the same time. For over twenty-five years after that, at random intervals that strange skin sensation would occur on different areas (usually a leg, an arm, or my abdomen), and I'm sure that that spill contributed to the sensitivity I have to these cements today. Glue-sniffing was in the news in those days, and that little epidermal experience was more than enough to convince me (not that I was ever inclined to do it before) to *never* try glue-sniffing.

chrism 05-15-2013 09:23 AM

It doesn't hurt to try something new. I would think that using something water-based for school children (depending on their age) might be better when it comes to clean-up. That way you won't have angry moms coming for you because they could not get the stain out of their child's clothes.

When it comes to plastic modeling, I typically use CA. It bonds well and doen't stink like typical model glue.

ghrocketman 05-15-2013 12:00 PM

When building Plastic Models/parts I almost ALWAYS reach for Tenax7R or one of the Liquid Plastruct cements. I hate CA for plastics; it does NOT weld them, it bonds them which is far weaker. It's like comparing the strength of a butt-joint to a lap joint----NO comparison.
Testors Liquid plastic cement used to be a 50/50 mix of MIBK (Methyl Iso Butyl Ketone) and MEK and was a pretty decent moderate-dry-time liquid cement. The same Testors cement no longer has the MIBK and is just straight MEK. It now also SUCKS and takes far too long to dry. If one wants a pretty close approximation of the old formula Testors Liquid Cement, just use Sig Butyrate Dope Thinner. That thinner is basically the same stuff with a little Butyl Acetate and Acetone in it.


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