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-   -   Estes D-Region Tomahawk Build (http://www.oldrocketforum.com/showthread.php?t=8899)

cas2047 03-24-2011 01:04 PM

Estes D-Region Tomahawk Build
 
1 Attachment(s)
I've had two Estes D-Region Tomahawk kits sitting around for a while. This is the skill level 1 kit no 2037.

I had tried to get interested enough to build this rocket more than once, but just couldn't make myself do it. I guess the two main reasons were that 1. I'd have to paint all of the dimples, which I knew would be a pain and 2. I generally don't like working with a lot of plastic and plastic cement.

Anyway this time I dragged the thing out and started building and to my surprise it's been a lot of fun. The kit itself is high quality. The plastic parts had very little flash (most had none) and very little sanding was needed.

cas2047 03-24-2011 01:21 PM

2 Attachment(s)
I started by washing all of the plastic parts in warm soapy water. Then I followed the build instructions, only deviating in a couple of areas.

On step 4 of the instructions the builder is told to put glue on the outside surfaces of the fin body and stuffer bulkhead and to insert them into their respective tube positions, and on step 8 the same method is suggested where glue is applied to the ouside surface of the suffer bulkhead to mount the two main BT tubes. Instead I put the glue on the inside of the tubes to save on the glue cleanup.

I also changed the shock cord setup by drilling a small hole into the stuffer bulkhead and tying in a length of Kevlar line that runs past the upper opening of the upper most BT. I connected that via a swivel to a length of elastic band (not the Estes band) but elastic waist band material. I connected the other end of the elastic band to the nose cone.

cas2047 03-24-2011 01:23 PM

1 Attachment(s)
The only other modification to the instructions caused me some re-work.

The instructions tell the builder to mount the fins before painting. I pre-painted the fins, figuring it would be easier than masking them off after being mounted to the rocket.

Can anyone spot the mistake I made. When I took this picture I hadn’t even realized that I had made a mistake…

DaveR 03-24-2011 01:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cas2047
I've had two Estes D-Region Tomahawk kits sitting around for a while. This is the skill level 1 kit no 2037.

I had tried to get interested enough to build this rocket more than once, but just couldn't make myself do it. I guess the two main reasons were that 1. I'd have to paint all of the dimples, which I knew would be a pain and 2. I generally don't like working with a lot of plastic and plastic cement.

Anyway this time I dragged the thing out and started building and to my surprise it's been a lot of fun. The kit itself is high quality. The plastic parts had very little flash (most had none) and very little sanding was needed.

Just finished one of those myself.. I haven't paint the "dimples" yet.
A couple of thoughts: I found that plastic cement didn't hold the fins on very good and ended up removing them and reattaching with epoxy.
Painting the fins was problematic at best. I decided to paint them before attaching to cut down on masking. I washed each in warm soapy water followed by wiping them off with rubbing alcohol. I applied a primer coat to one fin which promptly ran off the fin like water. Somewhat disgusted I got another and shot it with gloss black, no primer, same results. Tried another with gloss red, same results. Long story short, it took several attempts to get each fin painted, ended up having to sand the fins down to a real dull finish before the paint would stick.. After all the trouble involved I did not go back and paint the little fin mounting rails (or whatever they are) white. Had no issues painting the nosecone.

I was using brand new cans of gloss Valspar and el cheapo WM primer. I've never had any issues with either before, makes me think it's the plastic or maybe I just had a "flukey" kit. :confused:

DaveR 03-24-2011 01:37 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cas2047
Can anyone spot the mistake I made. When I took this picture I hadn’t even realized that I had made a mistake…

Looks like you didn't paint the little fin mounting rails white either.

I see your already ahead of my painting comments, how'd the paint do on the fins?

ghrocketman 03-24-2011 02:25 PM

Plastic Cement WILL mount the fins to the fin can tube as if WELDED if one uses the CORRECT plastic cement. That is NOT Testors tube-type cement !
If one uses Tenax 7R (best) or Plastruct Plastic Welder or Ambroid Pro-Weld liquid plastic cements (NOT crappy Testors MEK liquid plastic cement either) they will weld the fins to the plastic tube as if they were one unit. The Fin-Can will rip before the fin-can joint fails.
Those cements contain 1,1,1 Trichloroethane or Perchloroethane among other 'hot' solvents that dissolves the styrene to form an actual weld.
Not sure if you are in Cali if you can get any chlorinated hydrocarbon products in state any longer due to their enviro-gestapo.
Using the suggested Tube-type cement will result in nothing but fins busting off at the glue joint on any but a mattress-soft landing.

DaveR 03-24-2011 02:38 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghrocketman
Plastic Cement WILL mount the fins to the fin can tube as if WELDED if one uses the CORRECT plastic cement. That is NOT Testors tube-type cement !
If one uses Tenax 7R (best) or Plastruct Plastic Welder or Ambroid Pro-Weld liquid plastic cements (NOT crappy Testors MEK liquid plastic cement either) they will weld the fins to the plastic tube as if they were one unit. The Fin-Can will rip before the fin-can joint fails.
Those cements contain 1,1,1 Trichloroethane or Perchloroethane among other 'hot' solvents that dissolves the styrene to form an actual weld.
Not sure if you are in Cali if you can get any chlorinated hydrocarbon products in state any longer due to their enviro-gestapo.
Using the suggested Tube-type cement will result in nothing but fins busting off at the glue joint on any but a mattress-soft landing.

I used Testor's glue, scraped it off and used epoxy. As you say, the fin can will come off before the fin joints fails.

...No, I'm not from anywhere close to CA, never even been there. Just a yokel from MS.

cas2047 03-24-2011 02:38 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveR
Just finished one of those myself.. I haven't paint the "dimples" yet.
A couple of thoughts: I found that plastic cement didn't hold the fins on very good and ended up removing them and reattaching with epoxy.
Painting the fins was problematic at best. I decided to paint them before attaching to cut down on masking. I washed each in warm soapy water followed by wiping them off with rubbing alcohol. I applied a primer coat to one fin which promptly ran off the fin like water. Somewhat disgusted I got another and shot it with gloss black, no primer, same results. Tried another with gloss red, same results. Long story short, it took several attempts to get each fin painted, ended up having to sand the fins down to a real dull finish before the paint would stick.. After all the trouble involved I did not go back and paint the little fin mounting rails (or whatever they are) white. Had no issues painting the nosecone.

I was using brand new cans of gloss Valspar and el cheapo WM primer. I've never had any issues with either before, makes me think it's the plastic or maybe I just had a "flukey" kit. :confused:


I used a Metalic silver Sharpie to do the dimples. Once I did the small dimples on the fins I cut a bit of the tip off of the Sharpie to do the bigger dimples on the rest of the rocket.

I'm planning on using Epoxy for the fins too. I used the plastic cement on the nose cone tip and fin body, with some CA afterwards, but I'm not using it on the fins.

I didn't have any trouble with the primer, but I did have some issues with the paint, more due to ability to "always have issues with the paint"! :chuckle:

cas2047 03-24-2011 02:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveR
Looks like you didn't paint the little fin mounting rails white either.

I see your already ahead of my painting comments, how'd the paint do on the fins?


Correct! I painted the fins without masking off for the white mounting rails, which caused me to have to do that afterwards, which was more work. :rolleyes:

The only real problem I had with paint was when I went to paint the rails I got some lift up because I didn't leave enough time between coats. I had to sand down a couple of the rails and am repainting now.

DaveR 03-24-2011 04:37 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cas2047
Correct! I painted the fins without masking off for the white mounting rails, which caused me to have to do that afterwards, which was more work. :rolleyes:

The only real problem I had with paint was when I went to paint the rails I got some lift up because I didn't leave enough time between coats. I had to sand down a couple of the rails and am repainting now.

After all the trouble I had with the fins, I decided not to try to paint the rails. With the exception of zep and barone no one that ever sees will know the difference anyway. Noboby noticed in the pic I posted but they sure didn't miss the upside down decal on my Cherokee-D. :rolleyes:

I like the Sharpie idea, I may try that.


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